UFO Conjectures

Wednesday, May 23, 2012

Horus -- Flying Disk God?

Copyright 2012, InterAmerica, Inc.

 “Horbehûdti (Horus) flew up to the sun as a great winged disk; therefore was he henceforth called the Great God, the Lord of Heaven. From heaven he saw the foe; he pursued then as a great winged disk.”

[Legend of the Great Winged Sun-disk – Wiedemann, Religion of Ancient Egyptians, Page 69]

Setting aside the proclamations of the Ancient Astronaut theorists, can we assume that, at some point in the history of mankind, flying disks were prevalent or, at least, operative as aerial vehicles for a subset of humanity or even craft used by dimensional or galactic intruders?

And do those disks slip in and out of our vision or atmosphere even today?

Are flying disks mythic, or something technically advanced but prosaic when compared to the theologically induced mythos that religions have subsumed?

And while religions have co-opted flying disks, militaries of the world and most UFO mavens have also usurped flying disks/UFOs to bolster various belief systems and/or agendas, most, if not all, of which, have nothing to do with the essence of flying disks/UFOs.

That is, flying disks/UFOs are representative of something profound, transcendental, as indicated by the excerpt that opens this posting.

If flying disks/UFOs are, indeed, manifestations of something transcendental, they are removed from examination or cursory intellectualism.

They reside in the realm of theology or a kind of theology..

And observers of the phenomena, as well as abductees (experiencers, if you like), -- actual abductees – may be likened to the revered Saints of the Church.

That those simple folk – abductees, generally – can’t or don’t comprehend what they’ve experienced goes to how humanity has moved away from a religious context to a modern, technological or psychotic context.

The early Egyptians, Sumerians, Herbrews, et al. viewed flying disks in a transcendental or religious context.

Modern mankind views flying disks/UFOs in a materialistic, worldly context, while ufologists and their minions view flying disks/UFOs, generally, in a science fiction context.

UFO-atheists can be equated with religious atheists; they are the same ilk.

So, should we be taking a theological approach to UFOs?

Or should we continue to misunderstand UFOs and their mythic meaning, and continue to spin our wheels as we muck around with the misconstrued phenomena?

The choice is an intellectual one.

How many UFO hobbyists are up to the task, able to make the intelligent choice?



  • I'm more in favour of 'winged disc' being a symbolic reference that elevated Horus to a similar status as the Sun.

    If you read the rest of the translated script it becomes more of a recognisably symbolic text.

    Enemies were transformed into hippos and crocodiles. Maybe they were and who can say? It was a long time ago.

    Ufology sometimes sees itself in the words of the past. It creeps and spreads like mould in neglected bathrooms.

    In this example, if we're going to claim 'winged disc' as saucers, should we dismiss the idea that people were transmogrified into hippos?

    By Blogger Kandinsky, at Wednesday, May 23, 2012  

  • Kandinsky:

    Just as I see the "winged disk" as a metaphor -- a poetic metaphor -- I see the crocodile and hippo references as the same: poetic or literary attributions, not actual hippos or crocodiles, or winged disks, per se.


    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Wednesday, May 23, 2012  

  • In that case, we're swimming in metaphorical gumbo.

    There has to be a point where metaphor is dependent on something tangible.

    The 'sea is a blue blanket' describes something that is real and recognisable. 'Her eyes were on fire' does likewise.

    If we take the 'winged disc' as metaphor for UFOs or saucers, isn't it reasonable to accept the hippos claim too?

    If we go for 'Route 1' and say it's only a metaphor, it defeats the purpose of talking metaphorically; the metaphor lacks a subject.

    If we avoid all that and try and identify what the subject is...we're back to where we started.

    In that way, Horus was an imaginary subject described in metaphorical terms that leads us into abstraction.

    Bloody Egyptians...sigh.

    By Blogger Kandinsky, at Wednesday, May 23, 2012  

  • Of course, Kandinsky...

    We are in a gumbo -- with Greek myths, early Christian myths, Hindu myths, et cetera.

    But it's not as elusive as you would make it.

    Winged disk approximates what was seen.

    Hippos or crocodiles may be seen as caricatures: fat people and nasty people.

    My point is that descriptives have changed over the millennia.

    Today's UFOs are amorphous, because the reporting of them hasn't provided a concrete metaphorical anchor.

    But winged disk is simple, rather clear, and unencumbered by the often rambling, undistilled witness accounts that we've come to expect from those who have been visited by or visualize a UFO.

    And no one ever provides a poetic account....people. today, are not up to the literary task.

    Look at the raft of UFO writers.

    They are without creative or literary acumen. They blow as poets or prose writers.

    No, the winged disk account tells us something, as do other such reports from the golden ages of humanity....from which myth's truths derive.


    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Wednesday, May 23, 2012  

  • The winged disk’s orthodox interpretation is a representation of the Sun or a god like the Sun (who lives in the sky; a falcon God such as Horus in one of his manifestations - the protector of Pharaohs).

    But, the more fun interpretations I’ve seen are that it is a representation of the rogue planet Nibiru, a planet (Mars or Mercury) whose orbit was once much closer to earth prior to some Velikovsky-like solar system catastrophe, and even a depiction of a major planetary discharge event seen in Earth’s ancient skies.

    In any event, it’s a symbol that was borrowed by the Egyptians. What it represents is likely unique to the culture using the symbol because its meaning was fine-tuned to the prevailing local belief system. Modern day interpretations are probably just as loaded with baggage as ancient ones (e.g., the Soul, UFOs, etc.).

    Human beings seem to have an innate need and desire for a deus ex machina in their lives even as they reject their traditional religions and definitions of God. Since our culture (over)values and worships technology, is it any wonder our new sky gods are technologically-advanced extraterrestrials? God didn’t create man in his image, man creates gods in his image.

    I don’t buy a theological explanation, but I don’t buy an ET one either. I still suspect the explanation lies in the world of physics and is tied to a phenomenon we are not yet advanced enough to identify and describe. But, then, that’s just me.

    By Blogger purrlgurrl, at Wednesday, May 23, 2012  

  • From PG:

    "...man creates gods in his image."

    Ah, the Freudian view.


    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Wednesday, May 23, 2012  

  • ‘But winged disk is simple, rather clear, and unencumbered by the often rambling, undistilled witness accounts that we've come to expect from those who have been visited by or visualize a UFO.’

    It’s an excellent term for describing a saucer. However the strands of myth that created it are rather well known and extensive. As a symbol of authority and power it came early to Egyptian beliefs and is hardly surprising given their worshipful observance of Sun and hawk; many a nation since has used the eagle’s wings as symbols of power. Something inside of us relates to these birds deeply (Ted Hughes’ Hawk Roosting seems apt) and yet even the hawk can’t reach the status of the Sun.

    These winged discs litter our early history from Assyria to Sumeria. It’s possible they were all in the midst of a 1950s style saucer wave that spanned 2000 years and many a ufologist has taken the stance that ‘if it isn’t a bird, it’s saucers!’ The thing is, these winged discs were definitely symbols of power depicted by early civilisations. These guys hadn’t gotten into the philosophical contractions of Plato, Aristotle and Kant; ‘Great Schisms’ were a few hundred years away.

    Your Sun was your top God and the animal kingdom representatives of the panoply. Those snappy bastards, the apex critters that made life dangerous (snakes, hippos, crocs), got to be depicted as agents of dark forces; the apex critters that left us alone (lions, hawks) got to be the good guys.

    I don’t think us humans like to let go of our favourite symbols and we can’t avoid our archetypes; they’re made from such stuff as dreams are made on. It wasn’t long before our Sun disc symbol was peeping out from the back of Saint’s heads and marking out Jesus. In Islam, they took the lion over the hawk but kept the Sun-disc symbolism.

    By Blogger Kandinsky, at Thursday, May 24, 2012  

  • Kandinsky...

    Your erudition always impresses and I do not disagree with your assessments, even here.

    But I suggest that hawks and other animalistic imagery are substitutions for things revered but not understood, such as flying disks or UFOs or alien visitors, whether from galactic or heavenly realms.

    Just as the fish represented Christ for early Christians, the hawk represented Horus in a similar manner.

    And the Sun represents the ultimate God, symbolically.

    I won't go further into the Campbellian literature here, but will present more views/postings upcoming (here and at our other blogs).

    Symbolism, used by the Egyptians and other early cultures, is open to scrutiny but my use of it in this posting was to suggest that, perhaps, flying disks and/or UFOs had an impact that was interpreted as divine, from the outset but lost that cachet in modern times.


    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Thursday, May 24, 2012  

  • You could be right - I'm not against the notions of archetypes or their expression.

    I've read Campbell's 'Power of Myth' a lot of times and it certainly left an impression. I have to admit that I haven't read much more beyond that.

    The book came into my possession via plain theft - stolen from a local bookstore around age 17. Fittingly, it was never returned after I lent it out. I miss the illustrations most.

    By Blogger Kandinsky, at Thursday, May 24, 2012  

  • Setting aside the fact a recent BBC documentary successfully conveyed how truly shockingly advanced the Antikythera Mechanism was (while ignoring how potentially illuminating it might be concerning ancient 'fairy tale' reports about other 'magical' technology) and the possibility some UFOS mightn't belong to aliens or ultraterrestials but truly secret HUMAN societies...

    Isn't it possible the Eye of Horus's to be understood on several levels?

    Take the Egyptian idea the Sun travels through the dark on a barque: mightn't this be the technical language of the day's way of referring to the heliosphere? The crocodiles on this scale of things then might represent the incoming forces deflected by such 'guardians' of the heliosphere as the heliopause and the heliosheath (it's intriguing how we too resort to shipping imagery with the term 'bow' shock).

    Similarly since this barque can be equated with the Eye of Ra which isn't so much the Sun God himself but his protective 'daughter' (a sort of aura of intense potentially destructive heat associated with Medusa-like serpents which compels order on those surrounding the Sun) isn't it possible on another scale we're seeing a technical language of the day representation of the sun's corona and its so-called solar prominences?

    And since the Eye of Ra can be equated with the Eye of Horus (whose duties concern the idea of protection in relation to the 'Green One') mightn't this be the technical language of the day's way of referring to the activities listed above scaled down to the protection of the Earth (the hippos now representing the likes of meteors)?

    Add to which mightn't the uraeus or kingly serpent atop the crown associated with the Eye of Horus be the technical language of the day's way of alluding to the plasma tunnels known to connect the Earth with the sun (not to mention the one said to almost reach the Earth from Venus)?

    None of which precludes anything else said here but rather underlines just how intensely multilayered and multilevelled the thinking of the Ancients may've been (and perhaps the sort of efforts required by us to get the sort of possibly vastly superior handle on these things they may actually've had).

    By Blogger alanborky, at Thursday, May 24, 2012  

  • Listen fellows...

    One has to ask oneself, in a philosophical/theological vein, why the symbology means what it does.

    That is, what was the first cause, the prime mover that set up the symbolism in the first place.

    For instance, why a hawk for Horus and not a palm tree?

    The flying part is what intrigues.

    You guys all have a grasp of the historicity of the Egyptian symbols, but what caused those symbols to mean what they mean?

    A presentation of Joseph Campbell, in toto is necessary it seems.

    (And Kandinsky, filching a book...you? Oh my. Who woulda thunk it? The trangressions of youth.)


    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Thursday, May 24, 2012  

  • How the phenomenon is regarded by theorists and it's behavior is the difference between night and day.
    The Stoic would say it's not the verbiage that counts arising from sublimated existential angst posed against existential threats but rather what counts is the behavior of the phenomenon itself. Anthropomorphism and bias projection reigns supreme among theorists, then and now over the centuries. Theology tends to be coherent as a best guess with edicts and positivism as a intellectual moat.
    I suspect that at the root of the phenomenon is not a extraterrestrial question awaiting to be pried open but rather a human one.
    The use of creatures to describe the attributes of environmental characteristics by making their behavior analogous to aspects of realities has long since been a lost art.
    We have always had totemic proxies or intermediaries that bridge the limits of our biology, and this phenomenon is a strange sort of pantheism that has a technological sugar coat, that over time becomes a bitter pill to those so inclined to create totem poles.
    From a distance I suspect the observer and the observed are a bi-folded aspect that is dependent upon who is looking. This inter-dependance of relationships is beyond the ken of most prosaic thinking on the subject.

    By Blogger Bruce Duensing, at Monday, May 28, 2012  

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