UFO Conjecture(s)

Friday, January 18, 2013

Roswell: The Missing Documentation

A previous post here was about how governments and their military/security agencies engaged in mind-altering drugs, as a kind of war weaponry.

A New Yorker article was cited.

The new [January 21, 2013] New Yorker has some mail from readers, addressing the article.

One letter from a Mary Wexler of Passaic, New Jersey, told how her husband, Isaac. who, in the Army in 1943 to 1945, was subjected to tests hat eventually debilitated him grievously.

When he died, at age seventy-eight [sic], she requested, from the Veterans Administration, his medical records.

She writes that she was told that the medical records had been lost in a St. Louis fire.

This reminded me of the "lost" materials and files that the GAO noted when it went searching for Roswell documentation.

The "lost in a fire" scenario is a canard that governments use to keep hidden material and secrets it doesn't want the public to see.

But, as I've mentioned to Nick Redfern and Anthony Bragalia, no bureacracy destroys its working records nor is there only one set of copies of documents from any operation or mission.

Duplicates are de rigueur. And there is always someone who becomes the "keeper of the keys" as noted in the great science fiction novel, A Canticle for Liebowitz by Walter Miller, Jr.

What I'm saying is that the Roswell stuff is still extant, somewhere, held by someone or some agency of the government.

Anthony Bragalia knows this, and scours the nooks and crannies of Battelle, for instance, to find some of that material

And if the arm-chair Roswell debaters hogging space at Kevin Randle's blog with inane and irrelevant Roswell asides would get off their asses and check such venues as Sandia, The Naval Institute, White Sands,  and others, they may find references to Roswell or direct materials that pertain to the 1947 Roswell incident.

Nothing produced by government agencies is ever lost or destroyed. It's the nature of bureaucracies to keep everything, forever.

RR

39 Comments:

  • Your assumption is that federal and military paper records are somehow exempted by the universe from the misfortunes visited on paper records in the private sector. That's one somebody's gonna have to prove to me. After all those tasked with the thankless job of physically filing and re-filing them are similarly low-paid and low-ranked staff at the bottom of the pecking order.

    My second job back when I was still an apple-cheeked teen was filing paper medical records at a major urban medical center. You wouldn't believe how those records were often mishandled (drenched in spilled coffee and soft drinks), frequently lost (usually by being grossly misfiled or mislabeled and only occasionally found purely by accident), or destroyed (by a termite infestation, by a water main break, by being tossed out by a PO'd and later fired fellow file clerk).

    The Roswell event records, if they ever existed in the first place, may very well be gone; not because of some grand Machiavellian cover-up, but from the kind of routine accident that can happen to any stored paper records long before they can be digitized. It's time we all move away from a conspiracy view of the Roswell records. That point of view serves no useful purpose, and it's just lazy thinking.

    It certainly would be helpful to check for records stored elsewhere. But likely there are only references to Roswell buried in files related to and identified as something else (Chase Branden must think we're all stupid).

    It would require a serious, focused, and maybe even a lifelong effort to unearth Roswell records if they exist. But at this point, it seems it might be a much more fruitful line of research than endlessly going over hearsay and after-the-fact "testimony".

    By Blogger purrlgurrl, at Friday, January 18, 2013  

  • PG...

    You miss my point.

    I'm not advocating any conspiracy or even that accidents never happen.

    I'm pointing out that copies are made of everything in government agencies and bureaucracies generally.

    That there are, very likely, copies of materials about the Roswell incident still extant somewhere is what I'm suggesting.

    RR

    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Friday, January 18, 2013  

  • There was a fire. My father who was in the Tank Corps in WW2 had his files destroyed in the same fire. I checked this out thoroughly and this was confirmed by several sources including veterans who were still alive at the time of my inquiry.

    By Blogger Bruce Duensing, at Friday, January 18, 2013  

  • And there were not (or are not) any duplicates anywhere, Bruce?

    Had anyone bothered to check or did the Administration's statement (of fact, in this incident apparently) quell further pursuit of medical records?

    It seems unlikely that copies were not made (or stored) elsewhere.

    RR

    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Friday, January 18, 2013  

  • Rich:

    You make a good point about people getting off their arses and doing rsearch re Roswell.

    Spending endless hours debating whether a Mogul Balloon came down, and whether or not the size of the debris field didn't reflect the size of a Mogul balloon is, frankly, at this stage, fucking pointless.

    All that this does is suggest what Roswell WASN'T.

    Endlessly debating the Ramey memo will not prove what Roswell was. Again, it will just suggest the official story is not correct.

    Same with the crash test dummies: spending weeks or months researching about whether dummies were used in 1947 in the Roswell area suggests only one thing: the bodies probably weren't dummies.

    So, leave it alone and focus on not the distant past, but where the truth is hidden right now.

    What we need is a proactive group of people who go looking for where the evidence might be TODAY.

    Of course, historical research has a major role to play. But endlessly going over Mogul etc is crazy.

    The thrust should be on finding that "black box" where the info is hidden right now.

    That's the only chance of proving what happened. Historical research can only suggest what did or didn't happen. It can't prove a damn thing. And anyone who says it can is deluding themselves.

    By Blogger Nick Redfern, at Friday, January 18, 2013  

  • I agree with PG 100 per cent.

    The GAO was tasked with locating all Roswell related records in 1994. They failed to turn up a single one (apart from two that were already in the public domain).

    Yet you still claim there must be loads of such documents somewhere. You cannot or will not realise that such documents would indeed be retained (maybe with duplicate copies) IF they were deemed to have any importance or relevance for future historians. Otherwise why retain them? You are surely not implying that the Roswell event was deemed to be so important at the time? It had absolutely no relevance to anyone then and only has now because of the Moore-Berlitz book in 1980 and everything that has followed since.

    Any 'Roswell documents' if there ever were any, would have been regarded as junk and discarded. And that is all that need be said.

    Tony Bragalia, I confidently predict, will find zilch. Nick Redfern ditto.

    Of course they may well locate things that they claim MAY be relevant to Roswell. They already think so. Trouble is that nobody else shares their views.

    So, contrary to what you are suggesting, I suggest exactly the opposite - namely that there are NO extant Roswell documents that have any value to the case or to science.

    By Blogger cda, at Friday, January 18, 2013  

  • You know, Nick, that I've been in your camp all along.

    And I'm not blaming Randle exactly.

    He posts some interesting topics but lets the quidnuncs take over and run away from his topic to make those asinine points you cite.

    The current nonsense at his blog is not only redundant, but stupefying in its import or relevance.

    I suppose the fellows who are engaged in the silly colloquies think they're impressing UFO newbies or even long-timers.

    They aren't.

    RR

    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Friday, January 18, 2013  

  • Unfortunately, this was an era of paper based hard copies and no one had the foresight to store them in duplicate in two separate locations.
    Many, many vets had to go through a lot of red tape to get their benefits and I doubt there was any conspiracy but there was ( of course) stupidity and a lack of common sense when it comes to having only one hard copy. I was researching what he did in WW2( after his death)because like many vets of that war, as he was reluctant to talk about it. I had to do about one years worth of research to find the whole story.

    By Blogger Bruce Duensing, at Friday, January 18, 2013  

  • BTW
    The Army was very helpful and sympathetic to my plight and spent a great deal of time gathering odds and ends that, as a whole pieced together the whole story from other sources. They even found an obscure article written by his commanding officer on forward tactical communications which was my Dads thing. In light of this I can personally attest that record keeping was a fiasco but they did everything they could to dig up what was left. In light of this I would be a crank to say they try to hide anything on former personnel.

    By Blogger Bruce Duensing, at Friday, January 18, 2013  

  • When we accidentally doused a paper file with spilled Coke, we were supposed to photocopy it so the info wasn't lost. Instead we just tossed it unless it belonged to a VIP patient (the hospital administrator or chief of staff). We often tossed duplicates if we found them as well. Again, you have a touching faith in paper records handling that simply isn't borne out be direct experience.

    By Blogger purrlgurrl, at Friday, January 18, 2013  

  • Hey, don't take away all our pointless Roswell fun!

    Lance

    By Blogger Lance, at Friday, January 18, 2013  

  • Geez no, Lance...

    We wouldn't want to force you Roswell aficionados into productive labors.

    RR

    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Friday, January 18, 2013  

  • Anything explicit was never put in writing in the first place.

    By Blogger Frank Stalter, at Friday, January 18, 2013  

  • Bureaucrats, Frank, can't help but document their activities.

    You've read Kafka and Dostoevsky, right?

    RR

    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Friday, January 18, 2013  

  • Bureaucrats do what they're told too, and when they're told don't put anything in writing, they don't. ;)

    By Blogger Frank Stalter, at Friday, January 18, 2013  

  • You're "sweet" Frank....

    RR

    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Friday, January 18, 2013  

  • Frank made me think of all the anecdotal alleged events where some uniformed muscle tells some poor schlep to ( in effect) "lay off..you didn't see this and I wasn't here...we'll bury you out in the desert" and then perhaps in this scenario he turns to his subordinate and asks, "You are writing this down, right?' "Sure, Sure" Surrealism and Kafka somehow fit this alleged compulsive documentation of burying the truth or perhaps rewriting history with mimeographed copies that whither after six months into toxic toilet paper.
    "Make it out in triplicate.. every lie must be authenticated for future reference"
    Ah yes, the secret files, the golden fleece of drudging bureaucrats will reveal the nature of the incommensurable anomalies of space and time. I'd rather put my money on the Vega being reintroduced.

    By Blogger Bruce Duensing, at Friday, January 18, 2013  

  • An idea occurred to me that if perchance the ETs really did visit us at Roswell, or anywhere else, and we cannot find the documentation that exists, maybe the ETs have their own documentation on the said visit.

    Hence the SETI program IS valid. By trying to communicate with ETs directly we are on the slow and gradual path to finding the truth.

    So the answer is: wait and see. The ETs may be more willing to let us know the truth than our own governments. Just be patient!

    By Blogger cda, at Saturday, January 19, 2013  

  • Very funny, Christopher...

    But I'm supposing any documentation still extant will show that the incident was prosaic and you and the other fellows pestering Randle's topics will have to let it rest.

    RR

    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Saturday, January 19, 2013  

  • Rich: "And if the arm-chair Roswell debaters hogging space at Kevin Randle's blog with inane and irrelevant Roswell asides would get off their asses and check such venues as Sandia, The Naval Institute, White Sands, and others, they may find references to Roswell or direct materials that pertain to the 1947 Roswell incident."

    Are you offering to finance it, or am I supposed to fund it with my social security check? If you don't like the research, do some of your own. Can't your Group do it? Why not?

    PG, my first real job was in medical records. I was the guy who had to coral the surgeons and staff to sign their orders. Over my years in records management, especially during the conversions to computerized records, I've found forgotten records from pre-WWI stashed away in sub-basements. So, it is always possible records survive the retention schedule. In fact people hate to throw stuff away, at least back then.

    One thing I always look for is the retention schedule, which lists how long a record is retained and when it was destroyed (unless it was under permanent retention). if it was in the system to begin with. The schedule will retain a trace of the document whether it was destroyed or retained.

    This past year I found the retention schedule for State's Operation Klondike files. As I understand it, this is the only official mention of the Operation found.

    Records are retained for administrative reasons, legal requirements. Medical records get collected and organized and retained for the purpose of being paid by the insurance companies and to be accredited via audits. If there is no administrative need, then there is no reason to retain the records.

    If there is no administrative need, then there will be no record of an activity unless one is requested. CDA used to post about Roswell, "No report. No investigation. Therefore nothing happened."

    I pointed out Ramey said there was an investigation. So, where's the report? Answer: Looks like he didn't request one.

    Is there a record of what Blanchard did on July 8, 1947? No. Why not? He was on leave. No administrative record, besides the leave orders, is required no matter what he did while on leave.

    Quick critique of investigators:

    The dream teamers as a whole think they know what happened and look for evidence of it. This is a mistake, but not a critical one. It is just typical. They may paint themselves into corners, but with a quick-drying paint. They've made no unrecoverable errors that I know of and they've done some good work.

    Berlitz and Moore, Friedman, Pflock give no evidence in their books they understood the basics of the Roswell story. I'd say the same for AFOSI's Roswell Report, except they're OSI, so it could be deliberate.

    Regards,

    Don

    By Blogger Don, at Saturday, January 19, 2013  

  • This topic made me recall how NASA lost track of rare rock samples brought back from the moon, lost the original film footage of the first moon landing which if I recall correctly was found in Australia or some other bizarre and unlikely location, and then could not account for missing laptops from their inventory. Instead of a mythically huge secret warehouse, perhaps the real situation behind the scenes resembles unraveling the nests of discombobulated hoarders. In other words, what you are seeking may be there, like a needle in a haystack lumped underneath mounds of what may resemble a century of old grocery lists..Says the librarian, "I know it's here..somewhere.."while also looking for his glasses perched atop his head. And so it goes.

    By Blogger Bruce Duensing, at Saturday, January 19, 2013  

  • On a more serious side, a mandatory reading of Sen Daniel Patrick Moynihan's "Secrecy" is required to have a serious overview of the enormous decades long backlogged process of declassification that requires tons of paper passing through several hands while the same amount is generated daily. It's a process way out of anyone's ability to unsnarl at this point.

    By Blogger Bruce Duensing, at Saturday, January 19, 2013  

  • Don:

    If I thought that the Roswell incident was something more than a odd accident of some kind, I'd fund a search for old records.

    But Roswell doesn't answer or begin to what UFOs are, today.

    It's a kind of Ponce de Leon's Fountain of Youth myth.

    I don't agree that the ufologists did some good work when it came to resurrecting the incident.

    They brought bias and ineptness to the tale, and some continue to becloud the issue; i.e., Rudiak and you fellows who've kidnapped Kevin's blog to show off what you know about Roswell.

    It's not an evil thing or even a bad thing -- the ongoing never-ending rehash at Kevin's blog.

    It's that when he starts an interesting topic, it somehow manages to get set aside by the gaggle of Roswell "experts" who need attention.

    It's a minor irritation for those of us who'd like to see material related to his subject matter.

    Now, as it is, we have to sift through the comment baggage, which never brings us to a ufological orgasm.

    The foreplay is ongoing -- and irritating.

    Kevin knows this, but seems to like the quantity of comments at his blog rather than the quality.

    He lets everyone sh*t on his doorstep.

    That's my gripe -- but it's his blog so I should just shut up about it.

    RR

    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Saturday, January 19, 2013  

  • RR, Randle provides a public service. His blog's comments section is a warm, safe place for Roswell mental masturbators to congregate, keeping intrusions of that behavior to a minimum at other UFO blogs. We should be thanking rather than chastising him, doncha think?

    By Blogger purrlgurrl, at Saturday, January 19, 2013  

  • Yes. PG, you're right, as usual.

    He's confined the tiresome, attention-seeking Roswell reprobates.

    RR

    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Saturday, January 19, 2013  

  • Why do you call an exchange of information, showing off?

    You see no reason for the "rehash" in the 'missing time' discussion? In the Project Shamrock discussion?

    You want Roswell to be a UFO case, and you want me to investigate the UFO. Before beginning the slog through Sandia etc documents, perhaps you will tell me why you think there was a Roswell UFO.

    "When you're looking for something that doesn't exist, it makes you crazier the closer you get to it"

    I'd like to be certain the Roswell UFO exists before I go looking for it.

    Regards,

    Don

    By Blogger Don, at Saturday, January 19, 2013  

  • Don:

    David Rudiak has an obsession with Roswell; he needs to cleanse the thing from his psyche.

    CDA has an unconscious belief or feeling that something ET happened near Roswell in 1947.

    He needs to have that proven and it kills him that no one is able to do so.

    Lance Moody thinks the whole story is crap, and he wants to wipe it off the map, and clean Rudiak's clock in the process.

    Kevin's Roswell posts are all mea culpas for his Roswell mistakes, over the years.

    He want to clean his own clock, his legacy.

    You are absorbed by minutiae, and not just Roswellian minutiae.

    You have a need to pin down those nagging inconsistencies in events, the loose ends.

    But all of you can't see that Roswell is a dead or very nearly dead creature.

    And each of you is treating some aspect of the patient, while not addressing the near-death of it.

    Roswell could be revived if a patch of any one of things you guys are wallowing in can be proven: the mogul balloon aspect, the McBoyle situation, the Sleppy teletype glitch, the Blanchard departure, any thing.

    But no one is proving anything.

    All of the tripe online in the comment section of Kevin's blog (which is always redundant) is like swill that some ufological hogs are rolling around, getting befouled but resolving nothing.

    What has happened is that Kevin's blog, like UFO UpDates, has been taken over by pathological UFO buffs, causing that old bromide of "the inmates have taken over the asylum" to be exampled.

    It offends my sense of academic intellectualism, that's all.

    I'm being picayunish,

    After all, as psychologist Gilles Fernandez tells us, "that's ufology."

    I should just ignore the ravings, which Paul Kimball and Nick Redfern have already done.

    RR

    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Saturday, January 19, 2013  

  • They pick over endless, indeterminant and utterly inconsequential Roswell myth minutiae while ignoring the fact that "UFO" crash and conspiracy theories have been integral to the "UFO" collective delusion from its inception in 1896. And the fact that the Roswell narrative conforms to a folklore archetype and that "crashed spaceship" iterations existed in various locations prior to 1947 must be lost on those who would consider this paranoid nonsense seriously for even a moment.

    By Blogger zoamchomsky, at Saturday, January 19, 2013  

  • Rich: "But all of you can't see that Roswell is a dead or very nearly dead creature."

    As a UFO case? The Wilmot sighting is a UFO case. Not Roswell. I have no idea why you think I pick over minutiae. Is it because I'm not looking for a Roswell UFO, or because I haven't reified some philosopher? Missing the big picture, again, am I?

    Roswell is no more or less "dead" than anything else in the historical record. If you don't like history, read someone else, not me.

    All I wish Kevin would do is ban the skeptics so we could get away from their unending fascination with ET.

    Regards,

    Don

    By Blogger Don, at Saturday, January 19, 2013  

  • I agree Don...

    The ET fixation, pro and con, weighs heavily on the misinterpretation of what happened near Roswell in 1947.

    The Dream Team and our colleague Tony Bragalia would disagree, vehemently, as Rudiak does, but that ET overview has skewed any understanding or research about the "event."

    You are like an archaeologist when you get involved in a topic.

    You look for minute shards, hoping a few will explain the whole.

    It does that sometimes, but it's a chore to create a reality from bits and pieces, no matter how conscientiously they are derived.

    You like the trees, or rather, the leaves. I like the forest.

    The guys hanging out at Kevin's blog, like the campfire.

    RR

    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Saturday, January 19, 2013  

  • It is probably best if we Roswell skeptics were to shut up now and wait patiently for the Dream Team's report, whenever, and if ever, it comes out.

    I enjoy a bit of debate here and there but agree it can be frustrating, and boring to others, to go over the same ground again & again.

    Until and unless something really new and relevant turns up about Roswell (which I am positive won't happen) perhaps we skeptics ought to keep our mouths shut.

    By the way, in a more light-hearted vein, have you considered the possibility that the ETs, after several months wondering what happened to their craft and pilots at Roswell, sent a rescue mission to recover it, got lost once again, and crashed at Aztec? Whay hasn't a nuclear physicist like Stanton Friedman realised this?

    By Blogger cda, at Sunday, January 20, 2013  

  • Your Roswell/Aztec scenario Christopher is intriguing, jocular as you intended it to be.

    RR

    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Sunday, January 20, 2013  

  • Rich: "The ET fixation, pro and con, weighs heavily on the misinterpretation of what happened near Roswell in 1947."

    In my opinion, it is not ET or even any UFO that causes the confusion and argument about Roswell, but the press release -- and not even the content of it. Even the skeptics should have no problem with "the flying disc" in the pr.

    It is the story of the press release (not the story in it) that is problematic.

    To encounter the story of the press release is to encounter the irrational, because no matter if the object was a spaceship, a weather balloon/rawin, or Mogul, there is no reason at all for the press release.

    The mind searches for a way to 'normalize' the irrationality. The normalization took the form of making Ramey and Ft Worth the response to the "media frenzy" caused by the publishing of the press release, even though the press release itself is evidence against such a conclusion. I've labelled it 'The Bloecher Effect', since it is found in his Report on the 47 Wave first.

    One finds this normalizing in both Roswell skeptics and advocates, and in the investigators on both sides. It is not a conscious intention. These investigators know the press release; they should be able to see the discord, but they don't. It must be some kind of unconscious paralogical churning that allows them to hold on to the contradiction.

    The most elaborate examples are from Roswell advocates in The Roswell Incident and Crash At Corona, but it is foundational to the skeptics' case when they attempt to name someone at the RAAF as the source of the press release. Back in the 90s on usenet, skeptics argued it was Marcel. This past year on Iconoclasts CDA and Gilles argued it was Haut. In Roswell, Incovenient etc, Pflock insinuates it was Butch "loose canon" Blanchard.

    I've found it, as well, in AFOSI's The Roswell Report.

    This cognitive glitch affects their comprehension of Roswell beyond just the press release story. It can get into everything, probably even beyond Roswell, into the entirety of UFOs.

    This is why I am not investigating the Roswell UFO or debating ET or Mogul, but the press release story. That's where the minutiae come in.

    ps, I have not found the Effect in the Dreamteamers, but I haven't read everything they've written.

    Regards,

    Don

    By Blogger Don, at Sunday, January 20, 2013  

  • I agree Don,

    That damnable press release with the "flying disk" insert is the cause of all or most of the trouble with the Roswell incident.

    I've covered that previously here and elsewhere.

    But there is a premise that brought the press release to fruition, and that is where the core of the Roswell event may be found.

    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Sunday, January 20, 2013  

  • Don:

    Do you consider that the press release was purely a publicity stunt? Despite the serious nature of the work at RAAF (atomic weapons storage and 509th group) is it not still entirely possible that Blanchard & Co. were trying to gain a little publicity over the prevalent 'flying disc' hysteria by means of this premature PR?

    If the base had not issued this release, it is very likely the sheriff or even some civilian would have have done something similar, whereupon the military would not have been amused.

    By Blogger cda, at Sunday, January 20, 2013  

  • CDA: "Do you consider that the press release was purely a publicity stunt?"

    No. I think the press release was authorized by Ramey (and perhaps with the concurrence of his superiors). Since the press release contains the information that Marcel and the debris were on their way to "higher headquarters", the decision to do so came before the press release was written. Blanchard had called Ramey, Ramey was the senior officer, Blanchard's superior. At that point, he was the decision maker, not Blanchard.

    "...is it not still entirely possible that Blanchard & Co. were trying to gain a little publicity over the prevalent 'flying disc' hysteria by means of this premature PR?"

    This is what David calls the drooling idiot theory. It would have been bat-shit insane for Blanchard (or Marcel or Haut) to issue the press release without Ramey's approval since Ramey was now in charge. This is the United States Army, not Dr. Strangelove.

    That's the cognitive glitch which can be resolved by realizing Ramey was in charge from the moment Blanchard called him. There is no way to get Marcel and the goods to Ramey's office without him expecting it. In fact, he would have to have ordered it.

    "If the base had not issued this release, it is very likely the sheriff or even some civilian would have have done something similar, whereupon the military would not have been amused."

    The Brazel story had already been circulating for one to three weeks in and around Corona and I believe Carrizozo.The story had gotten to Roswell, and it was only a matter of time before it got on the national wires, and right at the height of the Wave. The army couldn't prevent that. They wouldn't know how far the story had travelled.

    I think they decided to 'own' the story, so they got hold of Brazel, the site, the debris, and issued the press release before the press reported it. This gave the army control of the news cycle.

    The skeptics and advocates can argue why this happened, whether there was something extraordinary at the heart of it or not, whether Ramey made a mountain out of a molehill or not. But I think we can be certain as one can be that the press release wasn't issued because of someone being 'elated' at the RAAF.

    Regards,

    Don

    By Blogger Don, at Sunday, January 20, 2013  

  • The press release could have been a prank with money thrown down and odds given on whether anyone would go through with it.

    Given the speedy denials and swooping up of all copies of the release, the above scenario doesn't seem all that far fetched. Because of the seriousness of the bomber group's mission the military couldn't and would never acknowledge the press release was a joke (if indeed it were). Rather it would bury or destroy all the "shit hits the fan" internal paperwork about it in order to maintain the aura of seriousness, vigilance, and steadfast purpose built up around the bomber group and its mission. It also would have sworn those directly and indirectly involved not to talk about it for the same reason.

    Hey, these were mostly young guys. If they were in college instead of the military they would have been taking part in fraternity hazings and going to keggers.

    The "Hot War" was over. Korea hadn't yet started. The Cold War was still gestating in the womb. They likely were bored to tears sitting around doing nothing in the New Mexico boonies.

    There doesn't need to be anything more sinister or substantive to Roswell than that. This sixty-plus years of silliness could be the result of nothing more than adolescent behavior on the part of a few who had too much time on their hands.

    By Blogger purrlgurrl, at Sunday, January 20, 2013  

  • PG, you are working overtime to exclude General Ramey from the story, even though he must have been involved. General Ramey and Ft Worth are reserved, I take it, as the response to the juvenile hijinks.

    The AFOSI in their Report protected Ramey (with the Bloecher Effect).

    Here's the Effect in The Roswell Report:

    "This press release was provided to local newspapers who sent it out to wire services. Meanwhile, Brig Gen Roger Ramey, Eighth Air Force Commander, ordered that the debris be flown to Eighth Air Force Headquarters at Fort Worth AAF, TX, for his personal inspection."

    You see, the press release's "flown to higher headquarters" did not happen. Instead, while the press release was going out over the wires, Ramey ordered the debris and Marcel to his office. According to AFOSI.

    Walter Haut was 25 in 1947
    Jesse Marcel was 40 in 1947
    William Blanchard was 31 in 1947

    "Hey, these were mostly young guys. If they were in college instead of the military they would have been taking part in fraternity hazings and going to kegger."

    They were combat vets.

    Rich, you see the dissonance here playing out 'on the hoof'. It didn't just happen to Bloecher, Friedman, Moore, and Pflock, but to thousands of readers and commenters about Roswell. It builds its nests in the brains of skeptics, and advocates get the fever, too.

    Regards,

    Don

    By Blogger Don, at Sunday, January 20, 2013  

  • Yes, Don...

    It's a kind of neurological or psychological virus.

    There are articles about that, and I'll dig up a few and put them online here.

    RR

    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Sunday, January 20, 2013  

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