UFO Conjectures

Wednesday, July 24, 2013

Three UFO Things That Make Us Crazy

Copyright 2013, InterAmerica, Inc.

Kenneth Arnold describing the movement of the nine “objects” he saw flying near Mt. Ranier in 1947:

[They flew] "like a saucer would if you skipped it across the water."

Who skips (or ever skipped) a saucer across water? A flat stone, yes, but a saucer?

What made Arnold provide such a loopy metaphor?

Then we find Jesse Marcel stating how he tested the so-called Roswell debris he had found:

“I tried to bend that stuff and it won't bend.  I even tried it with a sledge hammer. You can't make a dent on it."

Who uses a sledge hammer on a piece of foil-like metal? This wasn’t a slab of metal, just a small sheet of foil-like substance.

Would a person even use a regular claw hammer to strike a piece of foil?

What made Marcel use such a descriptive of what he did with the debris he supposedly collected and brought home for his family to see?

And then we have Kevin Randle’s blog going into the Mogul explanation once more.

The usual characters are debating the issue redundantly, with David Rudiak giving his laborious asides and CDA, Gilles Fernandez, and Lance Moody adding their skeptical retorts.

Isn’t Mr. Randle supposed to be looking for new Roswell material and information with his Roswell Dream Team?

Mr. Randle has now proposed that the Dream Team is absorbed in the Ramey memo, the White Sands accidents in 1947, and the ongoing Mogul Balloon controversy.

Mogul and Brazel’s debris-find have nothing to do with the real Roswell event, and Mr. Randle knows this or should.

That he sets loose upon the UFO world the same old, same old arguments by the Mogul supporters and critics is troublesome.

If the Dream Team hopes to gather support for new research, Mr. Randle had got to stop regurgitating old stuff, and his usual raft of skeptics have got to quit responding to the taunt his postings bring.

Again, the Mogul story has nothing to do with the 1947 Roswell incident, as we’ve explained and shown previously here and elsewhere.

That Mr. Randle and his sycophants keep trying to make it a major element in the Roswell saga is just loony.

Click HERE for Robert A, Galganski's erudite evaluation of the debris story and the debris itself.

(I am becoming ashamed to know the fellows who continue to be swallowed up by the Mogul canard. They are supposed to be intellectual skeptics but are, rather, obsessived with Roswell minutiae they have memorized and need to keep putting forth as a sign that they are Roswell “experts.” It’s more than sad; it borders on psychopathology.)



  • Rich said: "(I am becoming ashamed to know the fellows who continue to be swallowed up by the Mogul canard. They are supposed to be intellectual skeptics but are, rather, obsessived with Roswell minutiae they have memorized and need to keep putting forth as a sign that they are Roswell “experts.” It’s more than sad; it borders on psychopathology.)"

    Perhaps its more of an issue of "investment" of time and personal resources over the years. Tough pill to swallow once certain realizations are made aware or missed entirely.

    We all have our obsessive-compulsive components.

    The above can be said of both sides of the question(s).

    By Blogger Tim Hebert, at Wednesday, July 24, 2013  

  • Why do you denigrate Roswell skeptics? The reason we debate the Mogul affair (pro and con) is because Kevin brought up the topic for discussion. And Kevin tends to rebuke those who deviate too much from his topic.

    If you think that Kevin should either keep off Mogul, because it is irrelevant, or keep off Roswell entirely, why not say so?

    Kevin evidently still says Mogul is a part of the Roswell affair, even though he believes he and his band of followers have disproved that it was responsible for the debris.

    Do you have any inside information which either disproves Mogul or disproves any other aspect of the Roswell affair? If so, please divulge it - something really new?

    I do not understand your remarks about Ramey's memo. What does Kevin know about it that he has not made public? My own view is that he avoids this topic like the plague because he knows that if he were to bring it up, a certain DR would deluge his blog with his exhaustive and tiresome analyses (yet again) showing how the USAF fooled the world, and still does.

    Hence Kevin's careful avoidance of the Ramey memo. So far anyway. Should we be on guard for anything new on this?

    By Blogger cda, at Wednesday, July 24, 2013  

  • CDA:

    You, apparently didn't catch Kevin's recent sojourn on The Paracast; the Ramey memo and White Sands were the focus of the so-called Dream Team, he said.

    (I mentioned this in a posting.)

    You, Lance, and Gilles know that the Mogul argument is a side-bar. It has nothing to do with the Roswell incident, and is a red-herring fostered by those who wish to keep investigators way from the real Roswell event.

    Kevin, more than anybody, knows this. Why he's presenting old Roswell stuff that you supposedly intelligent guys buy into baffles me.

    Kevin is not about to disclose what his Team has found. not now, maybe not ever.

    But I will, if he (and others) keep playing around with Roswell irrelevancies.

    That some balloon debris entered the Roswell saga is unfortunate, just as unfortunate as Stanton Friedman's ET bias which warped the topic for all of us.

    As Gilles has pointed out and as the information I posted a while back shows, balloon debris, not Mogul debris, ended up in the Roswell vicinity. in the time-frame.

    It had nothing to do with the Roswell event.

    Mac Brazel's stupid find flummoxes the real Roswell event, and the U.S. Army used that nonsense to cover its tracks.

    That you feed the Roswell/Mogul "beast" with ongoing retorts troubles me (and others).

    You have fallen for the AF canard and now Kevin's attempt to take you guys away from the recent discovery which has nothing to so with balloons, mogul or otherwise.

    You're doing the Devil's dance and don't know it. That surprises and distresses me.

    I have always thought you fellows were smarter than that.


    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Wednesday, July 24, 2013  

  • RR:

    "Kevin is not about to disclose what his Team has found. not now, maybe not ever."

    Are you saying that Kevin and his team have discovered something new but aint going to tell us?

    These hints get more and more baffling, and I am going to ignore them until and unless something definitive happens. But what is the point of continually hinting at new revelations when you now say we may never know about them?

    I could answer that the whole Roswell case is a piece of unalderated trash. It never was anything of significance, either at the time or now. Far too many zealots have written about it, far too many 'investigators' have wasted years of their lives on it, trying to prove to the world that ETs landed in NM in the summer of '47. Yeah, yeah!

    And yet it goes on. Kevin and others keep it alive. You now say they are all talking irrelevancies and that the real Roswell is still to come.

    I do not believe one word of it.

    I do not doubt your sincerity but am afraid I am not holding my breath over the value of any new revelations, if and when they come.

    In the meantime I shall continue to debate Roswell on Kevin's blog with whoever pops up with something I disagree, or even agree, with.

    As far as ET goes, it is a totally lost cause. And if it is a lost cause, what on earth (or off it) are the Dream Team doing at all?

    Answer: just wasting further time and energy on nothing at all.

    I surmise that Kevin keeps raising the topic (in between other topics) to keep his followers interested and to keep the skeptics in argumentative mode.

    After all, it is pure entertainment, isn't it?

    By Blogger cda, at Wednesday, July 24, 2013  

  • CDA:

    Any new material will be controversial surely, opening the door to new hypotheses.

    That's one of the reasons why I'm irked by the regurgitation of the old dreck.

    The problem for me is that you and the skeptic guys are not looking at Roswell with new eyes.

    You're repeating the same stuff over and over, and Roswell is viewed with the lacquer of the past.

    But one can still take the "incident" that has become a mythos or static meme and imbue it with a fresh overlay, if one only takes the time to do so.

    Whatever you think of Tony Bragalia, I give him props for looking at Roswell as if it were a new event.

    Check out his new post.


    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Wednesday, July 24, 2013  

  • Kevin Randle is not the only member of Team Dream, what do his partners in this venture think about the sub rosa approach to the new material?

    By Blogger Ross, at Wednesday, July 24, 2013  

  • They are closed-mouthed. His silence tempers any desire to talk, sadly.


    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Wednesday, July 24, 2013  

  • It's been a good while since I saw the Roswell alien writing as recreated by Jesse Marcel. It can be found here on Galganski's page:


    It got me to thinking. Doesn't take a lot of imagination to see certain resemblances to the Isaac Caret drone language used in the so-called "linguistic primer" which can be found in all its exquisite detail here:


    There are obviously many differences but recreating alien characters viewed for a very short time many years earlier is necessarily a highly inexact task. Not saying there is any connection, but just enough similarity to get my frontal lobe throbbing at the mere possibility.

    By Blogger solarity, at Thursday, July 25, 2013  

  • "Who uses a sledge hammer on a piece of foil-like metal? This wasn’t a slab of metal, just a small sheet of foil-like substance."

    Well me for one in all likelihood Rich.

    A few weeks back as I was moving some music equipment I knocked over a load o' biscuit tins full of tubes of acrylic paint and as I was picking them up noticed this thin golden yellow pool of a glassy plastic like substance which turned out to've leaked out of somethin' and soldified embedding half the contents of the floor in itself.

    At first I tried the delicate approach in case it shattered and I got somethin' in me eye but after a while I was hitting it with anythin'n'everythin' sayin' "Why won't y'break y'bastard!"

    I was so frustrated I'd've used a pneumatic drill never mind a sledge hammer if I could've laid me hands on one.

    Still don't know what it is prob'ly somethin' resin based one of us forgot about but I can sure understand Jesse Marcel gettin' carried away once he realised he had a fight on his hands.

    By Blogger alanborky, at Saturday, July 27, 2013  

  • Acrylic vs tin foil, Alan?

    You did have something to contend with, but Marcel's foil was bendable, he said.

    The sledge hammer approach seems a bit much to me; after all this was, he thought(?), alien stuff or something exotic, maybe even something alive?

    It's just odd, to me.

    (Did you conquer your acrylic, by the way?


    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Saturday, July 27, 2013  

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