UFO Conjecture(s)

Thursday, May 22, 2014

The elusiveness of an MJ-12-like group

Nick Redfern’s hypothetical thesis about a possible UFO cabal that hasn’t been able to unravel the UFO mystery or what they allegedly discovered or obtained from Roswell in 1947 strikes a nerve with many UFO aficionados.


Because there is an underlying, subliminal perception that there have always been cabals or secret agencies at work in society.

This was true when it came to the assassination of Julius Caesar and the machinations to nail Jesus/Christ to the cross.

It’s a mainstay of historical events, too many to name here but a plethora of books have delineated such secret groups, from the Illuminati to the contemporary Bilderberg Group.

MJ-12, a hoax construct, resonates with UFO mavens because it has the plausibility of fact.

That a cabal killed President John Kennedy is believable for a number of reasons even though no substantial evidence for such a cabal has been found, not for a lack of trying by JFK assassination buffs.

And that a secret Battelle science group, The Stork Project, established to ferret out truths about the Roswell still exists intrigues but little is known about what it’s down and is doing in 2014.

A UFO study group, composed of military people, scientists, government personnel (from the CIA, NASA, The NSA, and other government agencies) is not unimaginable, and actually makes sense.

Why wouldn’t a group of select persons not be established to determine what UFOs are or were?

Does it belabor reality to think that Blue Book and other UFO investigational groups might continue to operate despite the official line that such groups have long been disbanded.

UFOs have a possibility that impacts society in a number of ways, all known to those who follow the UFO material outlining what would be affected if UFOs were determined to be real.

John Otto, a UFO investigator of the 1950s talked about a UFO “Silence Group” that supposedly suppressed information about an alleged alien or extraterrestrial communication transmitted on a WGN AM broadcast in 1954.

But if there is a Silence Group or an MJ-12 committee, why have UFO investigators not been able to uncover their operations?

Many of the other cabals or “secret” groups that perverted history by their devious machinations, during the French Revolution (The Terror) or in the events mentioned above, have been discovered by historians and writers looking to understand what really happened in key occurrences that affected human society.

Why not so when it comes to the JFK murder or UFOs?

Is it because those investigating the JFK matter or UFOs are tyros? That is, are those enamored of the topics or events not able to discern, forensically, the clues that would lead them to expose that’s going on, beneath the surface?

Or is it that the unraveling of the JFK killing or the UFO reality would undermine societal institutions so drastically that the reality has to be stifled or suppressed?

Or is there no secret UFO group extant? Or no JFK cabal at all?



  • Rich

    Aside from the issue brought up in my article (namely, that the secret has been successfully hidden because the material is simply locked away and hidden), there's another reason why a theoretical UFO cabal has not be found:

    You mention how historians have successfully ferreted out the truth of other historical groups/stories.

    However, here's the problem: mainstream historians and mainstream media people will not dig deep into Roswell, assuming it's all little green men-themed nonsense.

    In other words, something like Watergate or Iran-Contra was exposed because there were mainstream media people - with funding and connections - digging into these issues.

    When it comes to UFOs, it's just down to us - the UFO community - to do the investigations. And, although obviously a great deal of research goes on, we don't have the funding, time etc of - for example - The New York Times, The Washington Post etc.

    I think that very often people forget that one important thing: the reason historians or the regular media haven't cracked open Roswell is simple: they have never made a concerted effort to do so (unlike with Watergate, Monica Lewinsky etc).

    By Blogger Nick Redfern, at Thursday, May 22, 2014  

  • Yes, Nick, that's a primary reason for the dearth of discovery.

    But there have been historical amateurs who've unearthed major truths with little or no money, just ingenuity and determination.


    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Thursday, May 22, 2014  

  • As Nick says, historians and the media have not unravelled the truth about Roswell, and other UFO events, because of lack of interest; hence there is no desire to investigate.

    But there is another reason for this lack of interest: the UFO community, despite their desperate and endless pleas, have never produced enough evidence that anything extraordinary is going on in the UFO sphere to warrant science or the media taking such an interest.

    Official investigations have turned up zilch and all manner of private investigations/research have also turned up zilch (at least in the eyes of mainstream science).

    And if there is indeed an official cover-up, two questions arise:

    1. What is being covered up?
    2. Who is doing the covering up, and why?

    Come in Stanton Friedman.

    On second thoughts, stay out, Stanton Friedman.

    By Blogger cda, at Thursday, May 22, 2014  

  • There is a cabal hiding in plain sight, our Mr Bigelow and his team of research scientists who bought reports from MUFON, has Vallee on his team, etc.
    I watched a company representative of his at an aeronautical show hem and haw ( generally squirm)about what was going on per his interest in this.
    The whole Roswell obsession has taken away attention from other more potentially fruitful investigations by some.
    One particular craft that was launched had a very large projection screen attached to it to project images into the void of space.
    For whose benefit was this for?

    By Blogger Bruce Duensing, at Thursday, May 22, 2014  

  • Apparently Col John Alexander confirmed the existance of the mj12 group.

    but when he was asked stated he had covered this topic in his book basically he thought they might of existed to protect nuclear secrets an not ufos but didnt have direct proof either way.

    Has Larry or anyone else heard that this group existed an for what purpose?

    By Blogger Al12, at Thursday, May 22, 2014  

  • If, for example, researchers at the New York Times or Washington Post, had come upon something of interest, the editors would obligingly have accepted a request from civil authorities to snuff it on ground of national interest.

    By Blogger Yvan D., at Thursday, May 22, 2014  

  • Yvan

    Far more likely, mainstream, influential journalists would not aggressively look into the UFO issue anyway.

    After all, how many of them would want to be known as the journalist who chases little green men?

    Answer: probably virtually none.

    And so, the secret avoids deep media scrutiny. Not because the theoretical cabal is using sinister tactics, but because the media is looking for down to earth stories to cover.

    By Blogger Nick Redfern, at Thursday, May 22, 2014  

  • No, I don't think for a moment mainstream journalists would be looking at the issue. I was thinking along the lines of a source hinting at something without probing from the journalist.

    By Blogger Yvan D., at Thursday, May 22, 2014  

  • All true, Nick, but let's not forget the CIA's Frank Wisner and operation Mockingbird. If anything like Mockingbird is still alive and well today (I assume that it is) then the top brass and editors and journalists at the major media outlets have simply been warned off any in-depth research and coverage of UFO "secrets." I was dropped as an adjunct scholar at a well-known D.C. think tank one day after I wrote an op/ed on UFO secrecy. CIA intervention? Hardly. But someone with influence talked to someone at the think tank (I never got the real story) and I was gone after 20 years of writing public policy papers and op/eds.

    By Blogger Dominick, at Thursday, May 22, 2014  

  • With the size and excitement of ufology and 'I know about the truth' mongers and all of the scientific data gathered over the years about what can easily produce the physical atmospheric effects reported and many feature writers and a huge percentage of hoaxes (which even feature writers seem to admit to) and what we keep learning about human perception and human memory, does anyone still think that ufology must necessarily include visiting alien spacecraft?
    I had to get that question off my chest and what better place to ask it, thanks for reading.

    All the best, folks.

    By Blogger Woody, at Friday, May 23, 2014  

  • Woody:

    In answer to your question "Does anyone still think that ufology must necessarily include alien spacecraft?", I would say that it depends which country you live in.

    Probably most Americans, if asked, would still say UFOs are alien spacecraft (because they have been conditioned to think this). Some would qualify this, some would add extras like time travellers, 4-dimensional space visitors, etheric visitors and so on.

    Probaby only a minority now would say UFOs are all explainable in terms of what we know in science.

    Many would reply that they simply don't know.

    I don't know the latest opinion poll figures.

    Remember also that people in other countries may, or will, have very different views to people in the USA.

    Does anyone know of a recent opinion poll on the subject, either in the US or elsewhere?

    By Blogger cda, at Friday, May 23, 2014  

  • Aside from the private sector examining reports on a ongoing basis as in Bigelow's case via MUFON, in relationship with NASA, I doubt there is any need for a concerted research effort that is formalized within already existing entities, nor the extreme of having a independently budgeted
    well organised federally funded research effort.
    Theres no need. In fact it would be a stupid move in that the private sector is under no obligation to disclose anything to anyone. I would look into Bigelow's ties to NASA.
    There was a definite evolution of his funding of research and I suspect one hand is washing the other in collating data.

    He began with a broad spectrum research organisation and after dismantling it they narrowed this effort into more "paranormal" aspects at Skin Walker Ranch.

    Then they began to collect the details of sightings via paying MUFON as a contractor. He is definitely engaged in "something"

    You have to ask, what exactly do they have to work with in order to produce results? Take away the ruse of Roswell, there's zero to measure, analyse etc.

    You have a very clear actor in Bigelow Aerospace and yet everyone is stuck in the Roswell myth.

    Its a hopeless case of myopia.

    By Blogger Bruce Duensing, at Friday, May 23, 2014  

  • Also..
    Bigelow is the current incarnation of Howard Hughes and if you recall his buried ties with both the CIA and the military in managing and developing covert research and deployment of aeronautical and oceanic devices..now look at our equally secretive Mr Bigelow and his connections and what we already know about his interests and more importantly where he has invested his own money and now NASA's..They don't think he's a nut case.
    Again Roswell is a sad diversion into wishful thinking and Bigelow operates right under everyone's noses..

    By Blogger Bruce Duensing, at Friday, May 23, 2014  

  • A final note..
    Was it a coincidence that when I was heavily into publishing theoretical essays on the subject, I would get the same sequence of the same government agencies arriving in a 123 sequence?
    The Navy Intelligence, the CDC, and the Forestry Service.
    Coincidences repeating themselves?
    Who knows?

    By Blogger Bruce Duensing, at Friday, May 23, 2014  

  • Nick, chasing little green men should not have been an issue in July of 47. I'm on the road without access to my files, but one can find some reasons for the press not pursuing the saucer wave and Roswell aggressively.

    Concurrent with the Roswell press accounts is the story about the lid being put on saucer stories. Afterwards, the press, which up to that point (a few weeks) had not pursued the wave as a story (or could not characterize it yet in a retrospective way, since it was ongoing) began to follow what is best described as a "party line". A way to achieve that effect would be a chat with the owners of the major dailies and the wire services.

    I don't think the army would attempt that, not then. The likely effect of the army seeking to directly influence the press or politicians would be red meat to starving Republican Senators, with odds of subpoenas being issued to appear for hearings (including public ones). A civilian agency, such as the FBI, is more likely.

    Not having my files handy, I can't give a date or detail, but in the FBI files there is the account of the Seattle Times asking the FBI if it would ok for the paper to do some followups on the saucer stories, including interviewing witnesses. The FBI replied basically: we're a free country with a free press.

    I don't know if the Times did such a story. My point though is that some of the press was cautious, and did not know with certainty the official status of the matter, but thought they might have to ask permission.

    From the Air Forces side, there is Lt Frank Brown's widow, Velma. Kenneth Arnold published a photocopy of her reply to him (1947) that she did not believe her husband's death was an accident, and that the War Department would tell her nothing about it. Palmer, in Fate, has a transcription (not a photocopy) of Lt Col. Springer's secretary's (whose name I recall was 'Redfern') reply to Mrs Brown, that Springer said its a free country, just be careful what you say, to preface your remarks with "my opinion" so as to avoid any legal issues.

    I don't recall seeing any retrospective on the wave until 1949 when a Chicago paper did one. I haven't read it, but another paper referred to it. They interview people, including Kastl, I think, which takes it back to 47.

    But by then 49-50, the little green men syndrome becomes a major factor.

    Best Regards,


    By Blogger Don, at Friday, May 23, 2014  

  • Correction, the Velma Brown letter was from 1948. There may be one or two detail errors in my previous, but in general it is accurate, I believe.



    By Blogger Don, at Friday, May 23, 2014  

  • Thank you. I will try to ferret that information out as best I can.
    Mr Bigelow is a fascinating character who as a billionaire set off on a quest after the traumatic loss of his son into probing all things anomalous. One of the rare birds who can and has put money where his interest lie. The transition by way of their evolution is fascinating regarding his activities now focused on leading edge space exploration, a subject within the subject of the unknown regarding the possibility of extraterrestrial visitation. What does he know that we don’t?
    Rather than old yellowed newspaper clippings we have a living enigma thats been ignored.
    Here you have a reclusive individual who connects NASA, MUFON and the anomalous with hard core research rather than gab. Yet, no one has made the effort to get him to discuss his activities and \ or his findings because they are stuck with what they are familiar with, the minutia of dried remnants of a circular path. To me this sort of myopia is a diagnosis of just how dead the subject is and not because it ceased to be very provocative but rather became a exercise in clinging to the past in a death grip.

    By Blogger Bruce Duensing, at Monday, May 26, 2014  

  • @BruceDuensing

    This might be of assistance to you. The 2001 paper says that Bigelow has built a number of mobile detector stations... I'd really be interested in where these things are. Posing as meteor cameras perhaps?

    Also the Alan Holt stuff. Whatever they were into, they apparently flew an experiment on STS-9 relating to field propulsion. Pretty intriguing stuff.

    By Blogger Clayton Robertson, at Monday, May 26, 2014  

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