UFO Conjecture(s)

Friday, June 13, 2014

Verification of One Socorro Symbol

This is, as you know from my recent posting here, what Ray Stanford thinks may be the actual symbol that Police Officer Lonnie Zamora saw in Socorro, New Mexico in 1964:
A debate has ensued because this symbol was said to be hidden from the public on the advice of Army Captain Holder who was investigating the Socorro incident.

(Incidentally, why was an Army Captain investigating the event rather than someone from the Air Force?)

Holder wanted to make sure that a hoaxer would not come forward with an identical sighting of a UFO with a similar symbol, so a ruse-symbol was proffered to the media and public: supposedly this image here:
But here's a symbol seen on a UFO byGary Chopic in 1973:
Depending upon the orientaiton of Mr. Chopic's UFO and sighting, one can see what appears to be a similar symbol to that seen by Officer Zamora.

The Zamora/Socorro symbol, as I keep insisting, to the point of irritating redundancy here, is the "smoking gun" of the Socorro sighting -- find the origin of the symbol and you'll have the source of the egg-shapped craft that spooked Officer Zamora.

That presupposes that the craft is not from outer space, which I don't think it was, as many of you know from previous elucidations here and elsewhere about Howard Hughes, Raven Industries, and the CIA.

(And, no, I do not subscribe to the Anthony Bragalia hoax thesis. The whole episode is too convoluted to have been a concoction by the students at the university in Socorro, as I see it.)



  • Rich: "...a ruse-symbol was proffered to the media and public..."

    Then, the ruse-symbol was also proffered to the USAF's Project Blue Book? I don't recall if the PBB file also has the Stanford symbol. Am I mistaken that the Stanford symbol was published?

    Best Regards,


    By Blogger Don, at Friday, June 13, 2014  

  • Don:

    It's confusing. The inverted V symbol did appear at the time but seems to have been sublimated almost immediately.

    The symbol that has appeared all over the place, and which I believe is the actual symbol that Lonnie Zamora saw, was confirmed by Mrs. Zamora as the insignia her husband saw.

    The matter remains open, another one of the ufological muck-ups that seem to infuse most if not all UFO sightings.


    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Friday, June 13, 2014  

  • If this is a geometric insignia, it could be the number 3. You have 3 horizonal bars doubled in the verification within 3 sides of a triangle. The third prototype?
    I think the logical question is how a symbol is used before it’s determined as having a specific meaning. Outside of the earliest hieroglyphic symbols as well as Sumerian cuneiforms, we have commercial insignias as representations of the attributes \ identities of legal entities. However if this were a symbol of an entity based here, why would such a X craft bother to distinguish itself if there are either no other copies or any similar craft requiring it to be given a symbol as a individual piece or the intent is to make it untraceable? On the other hand, a phony symbol would be a simply elegant way to create a dead end, intentionally creating a symbol with no meaning. A misdirection of attention leading nowhere. It could have been created in the mind of the observer...having the same effect.

    By Blogger Bruce Duensing, at Saturday, June 14, 2014  

  • Also
    Another variation is A for American, three bars for number 3.

    By Blogger Bruce Duensing, at Saturday, June 14, 2014  

  • Would an experimental vehicle, one assumes a secret one, while testing in the field or being transported, have an identifying logo painted on it? Was that common?



    By Blogger Don, at Saturday, June 14, 2014  

  • If you were hubristic or ego-centered as Hughes was and his Aircraft techies, one could see a braggadocio endeavor in the form of an insignia...Kilroy was here kind of thing.

    It also gives credence to Bragalia's hoax theory...show offs.


    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Saturday, June 14, 2014  

  • https://overwatchdesigns.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/Picture2-600x503.png


    By Blogger Parakletos, at Saturday, June 14, 2014  

  • "The US Army bought the design from AVRO and the information on this subject was kept secret, so even the US Air Force did not know about it. This vehicle was shown on the English television in 2009. It was in the shape of a disc about 20 feet/(6m) in diameter and was handled by two pilots, sitting in two independent cockpits. The test flights were probably held on the biggest artillery ranges in the United States in White Sands, New Mexico, not far from Socorro. Most likely, what Zamora saw, was an improved version of Avrocar, which in 1058-1959 barely got off the ground. The fact that Avrocar used special legs for landing, similar to the ones Zamora described, supports this hypothesis."

    "We are not alone in the Universe", Kulczyk pp52.

    By Blogger Parakletos, at Saturday, June 14, 2014  

  • And the symbol?

    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Saturday, June 14, 2014  

  • Curiously the Socorro symbol you post is almost identical to the illustrations in "Raechel's Eyes" (2005), a totally improbable book on alien/hybrid encounters. It appeared allegedly on food and water containers and on the license plate of cars used by super-secret military types. Gee, maybe Hughes was breeding hybrids to fly his radical flying machines. Or maybe it's just all nonsense.

    By Blogger Dominick, at Saturday, June 14, 2014  

  • Mildly interesting. Out of idle curiosity I looked up the Avro corporate logo. Hmm..There is the pronounced A or pyramidal shape thats prominent.
    Horizontal wings are attached to either side which theres somewhat od a possibility (?) they could be mistaken for horizontal lines at a distance(?)


    By Blogger Bruce Duensing, at Saturday, June 14, 2014  

  • A better version

    By Blogger Bruce Duensing, at Saturday, June 14, 2014  

  • RR,

    The symbol https://overwatchdesigns.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/Picture2-600x503.png appeared as a 'Heavy Machine Gun' symbol in Google images search. The more horizontal lines (up to 3 from what I could find) on the 'arrow', the more powerful the machine gun.

    I had thought that a Minigun -- an extremely high-speed machinegun -- might fit the description, given that it spews out fire and might be said to make the kinds of noises claimed in the story.

    I think it's probably the AVRO flying car, though. I looked through as many images as I could find of it on Google Images. The AVRO logo does appear to be of the color red. I found one of the AVRO cars with a red logo on it, but it was not legible in the photo.

    By Blogger Parakletos, at Saturday, June 14, 2014  

  • P:

    The AVRO car i so disparaged that to think this is what Lonnie Zamora saw makes me and other long-time UFO buffs cringe.


    By Blogger RRRGroup, at Saturday, June 14, 2014  

  • The "Phoney" symbol appears to be military map nonclamenture. The "Arc" meaning "Air and Space" see:
    {note that URL that image is hosted on is a US Army .Mil domain and the after about 20 seconds the image is blocked but the whole document can be found at: http://www.globalsecurity.org/jhtml/jframe.html#http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/policy/army/fm/1-02/fm1-02.pdf|||FM 1-02: Operational Terms And Graphics

    The Arrow with perpendicular base has the meaning "Squad" though that is kind of screwy since the arrow symbol apparently is from Soviet training provided to insurgents.

    see: http://www.globalsecurity.org/intell/library/policy/army/fm/34-2-1/ch11.htm#fig11_10

    So Captain Holder was using known "OpForce" symbols to catch anyone that might be trying to do what?

    Could the real reason be that the symbol was substituted be that was seen by Officer Zamora was it that was attached to a "black project" of some kind? Could Holder's substitution be a disinformation project not for UFO investigators but to "hide" something from the Soviets? Or as a message to Soviet Intelligence since it was Soviet nonclamenture?

    The fact that the Army was involved at all indicates something fishy is going on since by the time of this incident the "UFO problem" had become the Air Force's problem. I have to agree with Rich... this wasn't a hoax but probably was not a "UFO" but a black project of some kind.

    By Blogger Joel Crook, at Sunday, June 15, 2014  

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